Name change? - Naamsverandering?

Volgens 'n besluit van die klubbestuur is daar nie by die pasafgelope jaarvergadering oor 'n naamsverandering vir die Pretoria Voëlklub gestem nie. Na die vorige uitgawe van Laniarius het 'n stewige debat oor die saak egter oor die Pretoria BirdNet gewoed. Omdat die Klub se naam belangrik saak is, is besluit om lede wat nie toegang tot die Net het nie, in die belangrikste elemente van die debat te laat deel - red.

Support for the name change

Casper Roothman:
[The] point I want to make is that although a name reflects to a large extent the character and essence of an entity, it is not a full representation of that entity. The full character of the entity really comes from the people involved in it... So even if the name is changed to "BirdLife Tshwane", it does not necessarily mean that everyone in the club is now English and are of ethnic origin.

Philip Calinikos:
As members of PBC, we all know what the club's activities involve and what we are all about. This is fine if we are happy to be prim-arily inwardly focused. But what does Pretoria Bird Club really mean to all the "out-siders" we deal with, whether in the public or private sectors. I don't think the name gives any indication as to what we really do, i.e. birding, birdwatching, bird conservation, bird monitoring and bird ringing as opposed to breed-ing captive birds, caged birds, falconry, bird hunting, etc. I have on more than one occasion innocently been asked by people, after admitting to membership of PBC, how many different kinds of birds do I have at home, or what is the most expensive bird one can buy.

Hoekom is 'n naamsverandering nodig?

Japie Claassen uit Koue Bokkeveld:
Skielik wil almal name verander. Hoekom? Gaan dit die Pretoria Voëlklub 'n beter klub maak as sy naam nou skielik BirdLife Pretoria word? Nee, hoegenaamd nie, want dis die lede van die klub wat bepaal of dit 'n goeie of slegte klub is, nie die naam nie.

Stephan Terblanche:
As verandering nodig is, moet mens dit aanvaar. Maar wanneer dit onnodig is is dit 'n vermorsing van tyd. Die onus om aan die meerderheid van die klublede te bewys dat die verandering nodig is berus op diegene wat beweer dit is so. Anders sal die verandering eenvoudig nie plaasvind nie.

On the inclusion of BirdLife in our name:

Frans van Vuuren:
Wat die BirdLife kant betref ondersteun ek die gedagte dat ons geaffilieerd is, maar 'n meer sosiale doel het as BirdLife en dus nie maar net 'n tak is nie. Dit is sekerlik ook belangrik vir 'n klub met 'n groot Afrikaanse ledetal om 'n tweetalige naam te hê.

André Marx:
In the five years since our club became the Pretoria Bird Club, BirdLife SA has raised its profile and is starting to be taken seriously in conservation and government circles. And BirdLife International, the mother organisation, is a leading conservation body in the world.

Stephan Terblanche:
I just think that being BirdLife "whatever" will give rise to even more questions about what we do, and will be even more inaccessible to outsiders.

David Swanepoel:
I personally am indifferent as to whether we change to "BirdLife Pretoria", even though it's sad to see Afrikaans being pushed in the background again. I'm sure everyone belonging to the Pretoria Bird Club are proud to be affiliated with BirdLife South Africa, but that said, I also firmly believe that we as a bird club have a totally different agenda from BirdLife's. BirdLife has a way more political role, an important one too, but certainly not quite with the same focus on birding than the clubs affiliated to it.

Ida Nel in reaksie:
Dit lyk vir my ons moet werk aan die persep-sie dat BirdLife en die takke eintlik verskillende organisasies is met verskillende doelstellings. Ons tak het in die verlede deelgeneem aan bv. die atlasprojek. Ons raak al hoe meer betrokke by bewaringsprojekte - die enigste manier om te verseker dat ons gewilde voëlkykplekke oor 'n paar jaar nog beskikbaar gaan wees.

Rob Geddes:
For our club to retain its place and influence within birding circles and not become a parochial bit player in terms of continuity, influence, conservation and longevity, we would be rather shortsighted in not following the BirdLife route. When considering the term 'BirdLife' let us not fall into the trap of personal-izing who and what we think BirdLife is. BirdLife, or the part of 'BirdLife' that interests us as we see them, are merely the secretariat administering the clubs at a national level. We are all members of BirdLife. For us to play a role in the national birding picture, BirdLife is our platform, take it or leave it. As to our own identity and that within BirdLife, no fancy name will make us unique, only continued innovated and active thinking and actions will do this.

Erik de Villiers:
Ek het nog nie "BirdLife Nederland, Deutsch-land, France" etc. teëgekom nie. Dus bly die klubnaam maar nog steeds 'n punt van debat waarvoor daar seker nooit 'n ideale antwoord gevind sal word nie, en eintlik wat ons almal maar wil doen, is om in die natuur te wees en die voëls, hulle gedrag en lewenswyse te geniet.

Tertius Gous:
Die laaste bladsy van die boek [Globally Threatened Birds deur BirdLife International] vertoon al die logo's van die BirdLife 'International Partners' wêreldwyd: slegs vyf lande (insluitende Suid-Afrika) uit 'n totaal van 99 lande gebruik die BirdLife logo van die sterretjie, en 'n paar meer het BirdLife in hulle naam! Nou vra ek myself af, hoekom is ons in Suid-Afrika so behep om name te verander om ander tevrede te stel, en probeer nie eerder ons eie identiteit behou of skep nie?

Sonja Meintjies:
Ek persoonlik dink nie ons het 'n keuse oor die "BirdLife" deel nie. Die klub is deel van die BirdLife SA familie. Soos ek dit het moet jy lid van BirdLife SA wees om 'n lid van die Pretoria Voëlklub te wees. Genade mense, hier stry ons oor die nuwe naam terwyl omtrent al die ander klubs al hulle name verander het en BirdLife as deel van hulle naam gebruik. Hoe vinniger ons 'n nuwe naam kry en begin gebruik, hoe vinniger sal daar weer vrede in almal se gemoed kom en oor 'n jaar of twee lag ons almal oor hoekom ons so teen die verandering was.

Drinie van Rensburg
Ek dink dis belangrik om met BirdLife Suid-Afrika geassosieer te wees... Die naam van die klub kan dus wees: BirdLife Noord-Gauteng en dan in Engels: BirdLife Northern Gauteng. Dit toon die assosiasie met BirdLife, dit beskryf waar ons geleë is / voëls kyk en dit kan in beide tale vertaal word.

Oor die verwysing na Tshwane

Frans van Vuuren:
More contentious to me is the thought of naming the club "Tshwane". I really take serious exception to changing the name of Pretoria to Tshwane. The argument seems to be that the current political majority will change the name anyway, so lets join in. There can be no honour in this course of action.

Frik Munnik:
Ek is seker die meeste van die klublede weet nie eers wat die woord "Tshwane" beteken nie, en voel dat die naam die meerderheid lede se belange en agtergrond moet weerspieël, en nie 'n geografiese koppeling moet hê nie. Miskien moet ons permanent verander na 'n totaal neutrale naam wat iets uniek (of nuttig) van die omgewing weergee, en basta dan vir 'n baie lang tyd.

Casper Roothman:
First, the name Tshwane represents the area covered by PBC more correctly, especially now that Pretoria is known as only the area covered by the City Council Pretoria. The area covered by Tshwane reaches from Hammanskraal in the north to Samrand and Rooihuiskraal in the south. It does exclude the Seringveld, and Cullinan area though. Second, the name also has quite a positive meaning [see www.cityoftshwane.co.za): "we are the same" or "we are one because we live together".

André Marx:
I find the aversion some people have to vernacular names like Tshwane a bit puzzling. When our province changed its name from the appalling "PWV Province" to "Gauteng Prov-ince" there were many mutterings of discont-ent. But with time everyone has accepted the name and today I think the majority of people identify with it. It certainly is a better name than the bland names used for Western Cape, Northern Cape or Northwest Province.
It is my belief that the same situation will come about with Tshwane. The Tshwane municipality incorporates a number of former municipalities from the Greater Pretoria area, the biggest of which are probably Pretoria, Centurion, Mamelodi and Hammanskraal (which I never knew was incorporated). We have to look forward and plan for new groups of birders in our area, which may very well include people in black areas. These people may not necessarily be part of the Pretoria Bird Club, and may set up their own club, as the newly-formed Venda Bird Club has done, but I still believe the name Pretoria is not inclusive of everyone in the general area where most of our activities take place, regardless of colour or creed. People living anywhere in Tshwane should be able to identify with our club, a situation which we don't necessarily have at the moment. Considering incorporating the name "Tshwane" in our club's name cannot be seen as a way of acquiescing to the whims of the Tshwane council or provincial authority.

Stephan Terblanche:
The problem with Tshwane is that you won't find it on a map, even if that map is produced today. The closest one will get is Thaba Tshwane, the former Voortrekkerhoogte. This is because Tshwane is not a place. It is the name of an entity, which has authority over a prescribed area, but it is not a place.

André Marx
Surely the name Tshwane describes the greater metropolitan region that most members live in? We have a number of BirdLife branches named after a region in a province, viz. BirdLife Wesvaal, BirdLife Lowveld, and even the new BirdLife Overberg. Those are all names that you seldom see on maps these days as well, but they describe the area the clubs come from, as I believe Tshwane will too in time to come.
Pretoria is a world class city, and one of the best in Africa, but it is not truly representative of where several of our current and possibly future members come from. I think we must also acknowledge that the name Pretoria is not regarded in the same light in all circles in our society.

David Swanepoel in reaction:
Sure, but then by the same argument neither is Tshwane. I won't offend some people by repeating what a non-white person had to say about white people's obsession about looking politically correct, but what came through was that some people's perceptions about what certain social circles in our society thinks about these name changes (unless we're talking about politicians trying to prove a point) are in error.

Rob Geddes:
As to Pretoria vs Tshwane or even Gauteng North, the smaller the geographical base of the name the more parochial and trivial will be the conceived impression outsiders (unenlightened birders, prospective sponsors and many influential decision-makers) will have. A name for the geographical area that we consider our "patch" does not exist, so we need look to the most suitable. That Tshwane does not exist on maps and due to the meaning of Tshwane as 'we are one because we live together' and is not a name with any political form, makes it in my mind eminately more suitable than any other suggested to date.

Erik en Mieke de Villiers
Die distrikTshwane of die gedeelte Pretoria, van Tshwane, is 'n gebied wat maar 'n baie klein deel vorm van die plekke wat ons as voëlkykers op 'n gereelde basis besoek. Die enigste rede waarvoor een van die name kan voorkom in 'n nuwe klubnaam, is omdat die grootste gedeelte van die klub se ledetal woonagtig is in die gebied. Ons self bly in Pretoria en weet nie van enige van ons lede wat hier woonagtig is wat al gesê het dat hulle in Tshwane bly nie. Dalk kan iemand ons verkeerd bewys!?

David Swanepoel
Ek persoonlik hou niks van die naam Tshwane nie... Maar wat van 'n gee-en-neem voorstel? Hoe aanvaarbaar klink BirdLife Northern Gauteng/Gauteng Noord vir mense? Ons toon so ons lojaliteit en affiniteit aan BLSA, Gauteng Noord oftewel Noord Gauteng is waar ons geleë is en waar die groot meerderheid van die klub se bedrywighede plaasvind EN ons het 'n naam wat in beide Afrikaans en Engels werk.

Sonja Meintjies
As 'n mens in die nuwe Pretoria telefoongids kyk na die nommers vir "local Government" dan kry jy onder die "City of Tshwane Metropolitan Municipality" nog steeds die onderskeie nommers vir Akasia, Centurion, Pretoria en Soshanguve.

Ida Nel
Terloops, ek sien die Simon van der Stelstig-ting het hulle naam verander na iets soos Tshwane Historiese Geboue! Ekself betaal nou al 'n hele rukkie maandeliks 'n rekening van die Stad Tshwane. Ek reken ons moet net 'n bietjie wag, dan verskyn Tshwane wel op 'n kaart.

Oor Afrikaans

Casper Rootman:
I personally am as Afrikaans as Piet-my-vrou and boerewors, but prefer to use the English name of the birds, as I believe it facilitates communication with other people (read: birders from all over, especially the growing influx of overseas birders coming to enjoy our huge diversity) much better than the Afrikaans names.

Ida Nel:
Ek was nog nooit 'n aggressiewe taalhand-hawer nie, maar het nog altyd moeite gedoen om Afrikaans in die klub te gebruik. Ek dink dit is belangriker dat ons Afrikaanse lede bv. Afrikaanse artikels vir Laniarius sal skryf en beskikbaar sal wees om Afrikaanse lesings by ons aandvergaderings te gee. Ek kan julle verseker dat dit nie 'n geringe taak is om elke kwartaal die program in Afrikaans en Engels te publiseer nie, maar dit word nog altyd gedoen omdat ons soveel Afrikaanse lede het.

Rob Geddes:
Not being Afrikaans, but having a dual lingual family, I would like to see Afrikaans being retained In reply to the name if at all possible.